The Chatterbox => Random Chat => Topic started by: Bobbias on February 07, 2019, 08:20:19 PM

Title: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Bobbias on February 07, 2019, 08:20:19 PM
I've decided that just for the hell of it, when I play osu!mania, I'll stream it. No schedule, no mic, no cam, but at least I'll stream it. Unfortunately I haven't figured out how to get an overlay that shows my score, and the judgements/combo, because I play with the ingame interface off to reduce distractions, but I'd like people in the stream to see how I'm doing better. Eventually I would like to invest in a mic/cam, but for the time being I can't really spare the money.

Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Spectere on February 11, 2019, 08:47:46 AM
So I was going to make a cheap webcam recommendation (Logitech C615—I use it pretty extensively to monitor my 3D printer and am pretty happy with it) but there seems to be an absolutely ridiculous price disparity between Newegg.com/ca and amazon.com/ca. We're talking US$32 from the US store and CA$77 from the CA store. I know the Canadian dollar is a bit weaker but it ain't that much weaker. I hope you guys don't get gouged like that for everything.

But yeah, if you can find it at a good price, the C612 is solid. If the C922 isn't much more expensive, shoot for that one instead.

Also, here's a few scatterbrained audio thoughts for when you plan to pull the trigger on that:

Look into Behringer equipment when you're ready to start getting that set up. Their little pre-amp/mixers are pretty decent for the price (I have a Q502USB—fairly light and portable and still features +48V phantom power for condensers). I also use a Behringer UCA222 and a pair of RCA to TS cables to bring audio from the PC for monitoring, etc. I also have an X1204USB mixer that opens up a whole lot more possibilities (such as using a pair of UCA222s to allow me to mix my mic, VoIP, and game audio independently and on the fly) but it's nowhere near as portable.

Speaking of Behringer, their mics are decent, too. I have their C-3 condenser mic and it has a tendency to err on the side of honesty when it comes to tones and has a really flat frequency curve. If you go with a condenser, bear in mind that they're very sensitive. I was recording something in a room at the back of my house with the door and all windows closed and if I turned up the gain I was able to hear cars passing by the front of the house. Condensers require phantom power, so bear that in mind if you decide to get one.

If you want a mic that'll give you a really nice, rich tone out of the box, the sE V7 dynamic mic is just glorious. The sound that I can get from that thing with almost zero effort reminds me of the tone that you'd get from an Electro Voice RE-20, albeit at a fraction of the cost. Being a dynamic mic it's obviously not as sensitive as my C-3, but when I'm recording I don't typically crank up the gain and then position the mic in my neighbor's house. :P It also doesn't require phantom power, which opens up the possibility of using a USB preamp or just plugging it into your sound card (using an XLR to 3.5mm cable).

Pop filters are mandatory. Shock mounts aren't, but they're good if the mic is in a place where it can get accidentally jostled (i.e. if you get a desk-mounted boom it would be a good idea to get a shock mount). You can arguably avoid using a pop filter with proper position and technique, but it takes pretty a pretty precise setup and that's not something you want to deal with in the middle of a game. The pop filters included on some mics (like the sE V7 I mentioned) definitely help, but they aren't a replacement for a proper filter. I haven't tried this myself, but apparently you can make one yourself in a pinch with a wire coat hanger and a nylon stocking.

I don't have one myself at the moment, but one of my friends has this desk-mounted mic arm and swears by it: https://www.amazon.ca/Adjustable-Microphone-Suspension-Broadcasting-Voice-Over/dp/B00DY1F2CS/ (https://www.amazon.ca/Adjustable-Microphone-Suspension-Broadcasting-Voice-Over/dp/B00DY1F2CS/). Definitely a lot cheaper than something like the RØDE PSA-1, which is about 5-6 times the cost.

As far as monitors go, I use the Audio-Technica ATH-M40fs. Good sound, flat response, closed-back, noise isolating, and really well-priced. Alas, Audio-Technica discontinued them at some point. They sound great for music, too—I used to bring them with me whenever I'd play IIDX AC. If you can find a used pair in decent shape, go for it.

I don't have too much experience with higher end headsets. I've used my friends' Audio-Technica BPHS1 and it sounded pretty nice. They're a bit more expensive out the gate, but considering you're getting a decent boom mic and a pair of solid headphones it's not too bad.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Bobbias on February 11, 2019, 09:59:55 AM
Someone linked me to this: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B01D4KYRYC/?coliid=I3EQR0EZ41XQAR&colid=R8WAG9YRZJEJ&psc=0&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it which looks like a nice cheap option, and at least doesn't sound like those scratchy awful webcam/garbage headset mics. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Spectere on February 11, 2019, 11:59:22 AM
I don't have any experience with that particular mic so I did a bit of looking and came up with this:

The mic sounds pretty good! He is running it through a Behringer mixer, so you may not get results that good if you run it through a sound card, but it'll certainly be a good start. Since it's a standard XLR mic you also have the option of upgrading to a Behringer mixer down the road.

One asterisk with this setup is that, depending on your sound card drivers you may need additional software to monitor your audio since some drivers don't ship with an option to pass the mic through to the headphones for some stupid reason. You'll definitely want to use earphones, too. Even with a cardioid pick-up pattern it'll still pick up a lot of your game audio.

Oh, also, be careful with the mic when the condenser plates are changed (i.e. when it has active phantom power). If they collide when they're in that state it'll damage the mic. tl;dr don't drop it or let it fall when it's plugged in and on. Also, don't hotplug the mic while phantom power is active, and bear in mind that it may take a few seconds before the mic becomes usable after receiving power. Shouldn't take long—IIRC, my C-3 takes around 5 seconds.

Aside from that, the kit has everything you need to get going! If you can afford it, I'd recommend picking up a little pre-amp/mixer/compressor along with it (like a Behringer Q502USB (https://www.amazon.ca/Behringer-Q502USB-Premium-5-Input-2-Bus/)—CA$94) but it's not strictly necessary. You can always grab something like that later if necessary.

As far as your audio signal chain is concerned, you'll want to run an EQ with a bit of compression. I boosted my bass and treble slightly and kept my mids zeroed, but YMMV. I just use my Behringer's compressor—which has a whopping one knob's worth of configuration—so I'm not sure how that would translate to the traditional threshold/ratio/attack/release configuration.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Bobbias on February 11, 2019, 01:15:22 PM
I mean, I grabbed this (https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/potato.htm), which will probably work as a software mixer. Originally I grabbed that because I was listening in on some discord chat and wanted to figure out a way to only capture game sound so I wasn't broadcasting their conversation over my twitch stream, though I never actually got around to seeing about setting things up for that.

I didn't think about how dropping it with phantom power could break things, but yeah I'm always careful with mics. If you recall, I did spend a full day co-op position in the recording studio we had in my high school. I learned very quickly to treat mics with respect. We had a pair of $2000 mics we used for overheads on the drums, and they'd have murdered me and hid the body if I broke one of those. And yeah, compression is a must on voice stuff.

As far as headphones go, I tend to always use headphones anyway. Still have my Grado SR125e's, though I REALLY need to get around to recabling them one of these days.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Spectere on February 11, 2019, 05:45:36 PM
Yep, looks like that covers everything. Looks like a pretty solid piece of software overall.

The main reason I went with a hardware mixer is simply because the Windows audio stack is a bit of a dumpster fire (though it's still waaaayyy better than what I usually have to deal with in Linux…woof). I'm sure they probably accounted for a lot of corner cases, but trying to mix, audio from one of Windows's many APIs (pretty sure they're up to four now) can be a bit tricky at times. I hope it works out well for you!

And yeah, I haven't dropped a condenser mic, but from what I understand you're basically screwed if the capsule takes damage. You should be fine as long as you keep it in the desk mount, though.

IIRC, overheads are typically small diaphragm condensers. I'm pretty sure if someone broke them there'd be no need to hide the body—it'd be justifiable homicide. :P

I wouldn't go with the Grados for monitoring simply because they're open back. I can even pick up audio leakage from my ATH-M40fs cans, which are closed back, if I have the volume a bit too loud and I'm using my C-3. It's crazy how sensitive those things are.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Bobbias on February 11, 2019, 06:13:38 PM
Hmm, I think that's one of those things I'll have to check out myself. If the leakage is low enough I might be able to just noise gate it away.

Just ordered the webcam, a bendy mounting arm for it, and the mic kit off ebay. The webcam came out to like 35cad off ebay for a refurbished one. As long as it works, that's fine with me. The mic kit was like $51 instead of $60, not a big save there, but free shipping on that one, so it was still a bit cheaper. The arm, I should have looked around first. The shipping on the one I ordered on ebay was retarded and made it more expensive than amazon, so I'm asking to cancel it.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Spectere on February 12, 2019, 12:37:48 AM
Ugh, I hate dealing with shipping on eBay. At least they added the option to sort by price + shipping at some point. Still really easy to miss it, though.

And yeah, leakage is hard to judge until you actually manage to get your hands on the kit and start playing around with it. It definitely helps that you already have a nice set of cans that you can play around with.

Another possible option would be going with IEMs with foam pads. Those won't leak anything (okay, maybe they will if you crank the volume well past unsafe levels, but don't do that, lol), though it takes some time to get used to wearing them.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Bobbias on February 16, 2019, 02:33:30 AM
Hmm, no idea what happened, but I just got BSOD'd while streaming with a heap corruption error. :/ Tried looking at the dump but can't get anything remotely useful out of it.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Spectere on February 16, 2019, 02:23:06 PM
My guess would be a driver issue (or buggy anti-virus software). Those are pretty much the only things that would be able to corrupt the kernel's heap. Even normal tasks run as Administrator can't directly affect kernel space.

I'd start with your video drivers, especially if you're using GPU-assisted encoding. Make sure they're either at the latest version or, if they are at the latest, downgrade to the next version down.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Bobbias on February 16, 2019, 04:24:57 PM
Yeah, I knew right away that if the kernel heap was being hit, it basically had to be a driver because windows itself and drivers are essentially the only things that run in kernel space. I don't use antivirus other than the stuff that I'm stuck with (such as chrome's built in shit, and windows defender). I'm using nvenc for encoding.

https://gist.github.com/Bobbias/808fab83b42de2043acaed17e22c0656 windbg is useless here.
Title: Re: I sometimes stream osu!mania.
Post by: Spectere on February 17, 2019, 12:16:42 AM
Yeah, odds are you're not going to get any useful information if the heap gets corrupted, especially when you only have a minidump available and zero source code.

If it does it again I'd try either swapping drivers or changing to software encoding (you might even get better encoding quality with software encoding).