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Random Chat / I got into an argument online...
« on: September 23, 2007, 04:39:57 AM »
Now, I hope you guys can manage this maturely, unlike Riha does, on the forum...
I recently got into a religion argument on another forum I go to (and am probably leaving soon.) However, the person I was arguing with obviously doesn't understand the concept of a proper argument. All of their posts were personal attacks on me, and were quite scathing, while I was intending to put forth a simple argument on the subject of religion, and the fact that organized church is not really a good thing, since politics, ambition, and corruption make many members of the church use the words of the bible in ways they were not intended to be used simply to exert control over people.
My original post:
Looking back, it could have been worded MUCH better, but as you can see, I was NOT trying to insult anyone as a person, but simply point out the flaws I see in the church and tell them WHY I believe what I do. You will note that I did in fact endorse jesus's teachings.
Personal attack #1. Not only does she take the lord's name in vain, she presumes to judge me as a human and tell me the exact thing I've been saying all along: people CAN believe what they want. I do not presume to be god once in my post, do I? I do not believe it's wrong to point out flaws in other people's religions, because without knowing of those flaws, they cannot be fixed.
Offended, I respond like this:
I don't need to say any more about that one.
Hmm, sounds to me like she's run out of fuel. Maybe it's because I seem to have a better argument for why I'm saying what I'm saying? Either that, or all that naruto and spongebob she's been watching made her retarded.
Trainz_07 then responded with this:
I recently got into a religion argument on another forum I go to (and am probably leaving soon.) However, the person I was arguing with obviously doesn't understand the concept of a proper argument. All of their posts were personal attacks on me, and were quite scathing, while I was intending to put forth a simple argument on the subject of religion, and the fact that organized church is not really a good thing, since politics, ambition, and corruption make many members of the church use the words of the bible in ways they were not intended to be used simply to exert control over people.
My original post:
Quote from: Bobbias
My truth is that regardless of whether jesus was in any way related to god, he had some good ideas. People should follow the morals, but the idea of instantly being forgiven is stupid, and other religious things are stupid. I don't believe in organized religion, because as far as I'm concerned they are just there for crowd control. Look at the dark ages, they were dark because the church refused to teach the masses science, so everything was based around the church, and so the church held power over everyone. Whatever the church said, must be true, because they can communicate with god! they MUST be right.. Yeah. ok.
Looking back, it could have been worded MUCH better, but as you can see, I was NOT trying to insult anyone as a person, but simply point out the flaws I see in the church and tell them WHY I believe what I do. You will note that I did in fact endorse jesus's teachings.
Quote from: xXRiha-ChanXx
Why can't you respect people for once? God dammit you piss me off. Just shut up, okay? We all have a right to believe what we want! Who the hell made you God to tell us what's right and what's wrong to believe in?! Just stop it! It's wrong to look down on others religions and it's in the frikken rules of the forum go read it.
Personal attack #1. Not only does she take the lord's name in vain, she presumes to judge me as a human and tell me the exact thing I've been saying all along: people CAN believe what they want. I do not presume to be god once in my post, do I? I do not believe it's wrong to point out flaws in other people's religions, because without knowing of those flaws, they cannot be fixed.
Offended, I respond like this:
Quote from: Bobbias
If an admin is offended, he can ban me.
I disrespect the church, not their beliefs. It's not my problem if they are offended by the fact that I don't believe in a church. I'm not a church burner, and I will respect their beliefs, but I don't believe in them, and will say that I do not believe in it.
You are judging me as a person, which is worse than me insulting the church.
"Judge not, lest ye be judged yourself"
I believe in that saying. I don't believe in the church, and I don't believe in the truth of the bible's stories. That doesn't mean I am disrespecting them.
"Do not point out the twig in your brother's eye when you cannot see the log in your own"
Your judgment of me may have been called upon by the fact that I judged the church, but I will NOT stand for being insulted for STATING MY BELIEFS.
Yes, I am opposed to organized religion, and all the church stuff, and yes, I will readily say that in the off chance that I may sway people from believing some of the stuff that is pointless. (such as all that stupid stuff in church and such. I know because I went to catholic schools and have gone to church with my schools.)
I am sick and fucking tired of you being an asshole every time I state my OPINION of what I BELIEVE. I am NOT trying to insult you, or any member of this site, and my posts are OBJECTIVE VIEWS. They are not a personal attack on anyone, and they aren't intended to be. So quit being such an asshole and insulting ME when I insult an IDEA.
For christ's fucking sake. You are being a hypocrite for insulting me as a person for me presenting my beliefs.
I don't need to say any more about that one.
Quote from: xXRiha-ChanXx
Oh dear me. Am i offending you? Tsk tsk shame on me. LOL i laughed when i read that. Hate me, go ahead
Blah blah blah that's basically all i got from your post. Make it smaller next time maybe i'll read it all.
Anyway, ummm yea. State your opinions, go ahead. But the way you state them you use offensiveness in it. And i was just pointing it out. Instead of hating on things, (like you were in your previous post) you could've just said "I don't believe in God or any religion." Not rant on about how you find church ways this, that or the other thing. That's what i was pointing out. Jesus.
Hmm, sounds to me like she's run out of fuel. Maybe it's because I seem to have a better argument for why I'm saying what I'm saying? Either that, or all that naruto and spongebob she's been watching made her retarded.
Trainz_07 then responded with this:
Quote from: Trainz_07
Sigh, I was afraid that something like this might occur
History's flaws have yet again revealed itself, in the past churches were organizations that ruled with an iron fist, not because they had the power of military arms, but the power of beliefs and religions. As said in ancient texts, religion was a powerful thing that even kings would bow down to, that was because people had faith in their religion, do the Templars ring a bell?
That's how wars start, because of religion, I'm not saying believing in a religion is bad, no absolutely not. However when one becomes too much of a zealot and he/she looks down upon other religion, conflict arises, unneeded conflict. God wanted us to live in peace, did He not? Why should people take away lives in the name of their religion, that's not called being a true believer or a zealot, that's absurd in my opinion.
It wasn't the religion that started the wars, it was the people's heart who thought that their religion was absolute and the one and only. That's not true, because religions were made for people to believe in, not use them as an excuse to take away land and lives.
Originally quoted by the Encyclopedia of Religion
"In summary, it may be said that almost every known culture involves the religious in the above sense of a depth dimension in cultural experiences at all levels