Author Topic: Racing Sims  (Read 783 times)

vladgd

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Re: Racing Sims
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2022, 08:29:11 PM »
I'm curious: does the brake pedal have spring tension on it? Like, it doesn't just go to the floor when you press it lightly, does it?
I have video.If you're curious about anything else and I'll see what I can do.

It kind of seems like if I want to get a console-compatible wheel I'm going to have to pick a faction, at least for the time being. Since I've got the SeX I'm probably going to get a wheel that works with that, and after that I might look into getting something that I can hook up to the PS4.

Or maybe a PS5, if those things ever actually come out. :)

Yeah I'd go with where the majority of your hours will be spent. Gran Turismo vs Forza, with...everything else being pc so at least you can use whatever on that platform.

And good luck to both of us finding a ps5. Shoulda bought one last November when I seen them in person...

Spectere

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Re: Racing Sims
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2022, 10:45:54 PM »
I have video.If you're curious about anything else and I'll see what I can do.

I SAW A KITTY.

And yeah, that's exactly what I was looking for. I kinda doubted it would be one of those setups where the brake pedal would just flop down to the floor with zero pressure, but it's good to know how it works.

Thanks for the vid!

Yeah I'd go with where the majority of your hours will be spent. Gran Turismo vs Forza, with...everything else being pc so at least you can use whatever on that platform.

The problem with me is that I generally like both games equally, haha. I somewhat doubt that the graphics are going to be too different between the Series X and the PS4 Pro (I mean, FM7 is technically an Xbox One game and it still looks fantastic. Racing games just don't seem to age as quickly), but I guess it would still be best to favor the current-gen console? I dunno.

Then again, GT7 is actually out and FM8 kinda isn't. But I have a copy of FM7, which is still hella fun?

Gah.

And good luck to both of us finding a ps5. Shoulda bought one last November when I seen them in person...

I don't know anyone who owns a PS5, yet I know two other people that own the Series X. I'm not sure if Microsoft's just not selling as many units or if they're just legitimately doing a better job with the whole manufacturing thing.

On one hand I could probably do without it, but on the other hand the new Patchet & Clank game looks incredibly fun, and despite my mixed feelings of the FF7 Remake so far I would like to see more of it.
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vladgd

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Re: Racing Sims
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2022, 09:09:59 PM »
Then again, GT7 is actually out and FM8 kinda isn't. But I have a copy of FM7, which is still hella fun?

Tough call. Easy for me since the last xbox I bought was the 360. I'm almost 80 hours in on GT7 so I think regardless of it's problems, it's a good enough game where I am still playing it. One thing to mention, since GT7 is a "live service" game, it makes you play differently than a normal game.

There's a...bug? Probably, that takes the dodge tomahawk x which is a 1200 or something PP car, and you can mess with the gear ratio to a point where it knocks it down to 560. You then take this car which has stupid speed and grip into the wtc600 race on tokyo expressway. 12 laps, ~500,000cr payout, ~850,000cr with clean race bonus (even ramming walls and bumping other cars, for whatever reason I ALWAYS get clean race bonus). It's just too damn good not to do.

How is this a problem? Well it makes me feel like doing this race non fucking stop because I know goddamn well it's getting nerfed on Thursday. AND I GET IT, it's too good, I wouldn't complain. BUT time is ticking, knowing they have taken things away means this will not exist very soon, so if I have time to race, I feel like I have to race. Kinda sucks. There's other races that are less efficient (although quite good, this race is busted) it just feels like those can wait until this gets nerfed, because likely those'll stay, and this one won't.

tl;dr

You wanna play old game that ain't changing for shit, or new game that changes several times a month?

I don't know anyone who owns a PS5, yet I know two other people that own the Series X. I'm not sure if Microsoft's just not selling as many units or if they're just legitimately doing a better job with the whole manufacturing thing.

On one hand I could probably do without it, but on the other hand the new Patchet & Clank game looks incredibly fun, and despite my mixed feelings of the FF7 Remake so far I would like to see more of it.

Not sure if it's like this where you live, but I've noticed in a few stores there isn't even a section they'd stock playstation consoles. Like there's switches behind glasses, the xbox section usually has mostly nothing or a single series S console, and the playstation section...isn't there? Like you can buy games and controllers, but not even a section they'd stock a console. I noticed this at a target today and found it kind of strange...although I understand not wanting to waste space for something that isn't going to be there. It's like looking for bigfoot or something. Like why stock ps5 games and controllers but not even have an empty section for ps5's? HEY YO WE SELL NINTENDO SWITCH GAMES AND CONTROLLERS BUT NO NINTENDO SWITCH! Child me would have issues believing it.

AANNNDDDD a few notes on the wheel. Messing with settings is making things easier, looking up the fanatec recommended settings makes steering easier, but they see the force feedback toned down, which also makes things easier but less immersive. Will need to do more googling and experimenting with settings, would like a balance between immersion and improving my skill. With some of the grinding I've been doing on GT I have been going back and forth between the wheel and controller. The wheel can be physically fatiguing, and my times on pad still blow the pants off my  wheel times. I am improving enough to actually play the game instead of crash everywhere, but it'll be some time before im actually confident with the thing.

Being a bit discouraged, I have noticed I am not alone. Going from pad to wheel is like "way more fun, more immersive, but god damn is it hard and my times are worse".

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Re: Racing Sims
« Reply #18 on: April 12, 2022, 05:52:10 PM »
There's a...bug? Probably, that takes the dodge tomahawk x which is a 1200 or something PP car, and you can mess with the gear ratio to a point where it knocks it down to 560. You then take this car which has stupid speed and grip into the wtc600 race on tokyo expressway. 12 laps, ~500,000cr payout, ~850,000cr with clean race bonus (even ramming walls and bumping other cars, for whatever reason I ALWAYS get clean race bonus). It's just too damn good not to do.

Heh. To be fair, this has been a problem since the dawn of time with GT due to the sheer number of variables at play. The main difference is that since GT5 they've been able to actually patch this stuff.

I'm not sure it's ever been quite that out of whack (though I distinctly recall GT3 having some very, uh, interesting quirks), but I haven't really looked into it in any sort of real detail.

Not sure if it's like this where you live, but I've noticed in a few stores there isn't even a section they'd stock playstation consoles. Like there's switches behind glasses, the xbox section usually has mostly nothing or a single series S console, and the playstation section...isn't there? Like you can buy games and controllers, but not even a section they'd stock a console.

I'm not sure if this is still the case, but a few months ago that was the case for both the PS5 and Xbox Series consoles at my local Best Buy. Both the PS5 and XBS/XBX systems were perpetually out of stock to the point where they reallocated the shelf space to things that actually exist. I think they've been having a slightly easier time with the Switch, since there was still shelf space for it, albeit no consoles up for sale. Considering the Switch came out in 2016 that's still kind of impressive IMO.

The only reason I ended up getting my Series X is because they had some program where you could effectively reserve a console if you used a special financing option that covered both the system and two years of GamePass Ultimate. It was slightly more than the combined cost of both (I think it was like $40 more?), but 1) it's still way cheaper than buying it from a scumbag scalper, 2) I would upgraded to GamePass Ultimate anyway (I was already a GamePass PC subscriber), and 3) you can unlock dev mode and install RetroArch, and it's one of the most powerful off-the-shelf emulation boxes money can buy.

AANNNDDDD a few notes on the wheel. Messing with settings is making things easier, looking up the fanatec recommended settings makes steering easier, but they see the force feedback toned down, which also makes things easier but less immersive. Will need to do more googling and experimenting with settings, would like a balance between immersion and improving my skill. With some of the grinding I've been doing on GT I have been going back and forth between the wheel and controller. The wheel can be physically fatiguing, and my times on pad still blow the pants off my  wheel times. I am improving enough to actually play the game instead of crash everywhere, but it'll be some time before im actually confident with the thing.

Being a bit discouraged, I have noticed I am not alone. Going from pad to wheel is like "way more fun, more immersive, but god damn is it hard and my times are worse".

Oh no, you're definitely not alone. There's a pretty big adjustment period with any dedicated controller, but I think steering wheels are probably one of the most extreme cases of that. I think the only thing that's easier with the wheel is shifting with a clutch (Forza lets you do that with a gamepad, but it never felt right to me).

You pretty much have to work up to a point where the wheel becomes second nature, to the point where its primary advantages over the gamepad win out. It's not at all surprising that wheels give you more granular control over the vehicle, but one thing that they don't have is input dampening (except in Horizon, apparently, which is another good reason to avoid that game). Racing games apply a bunch of input filtering on gamepads in order to prevent rapid thumb movements from causing the controls to spaz out. That's good because it makes them actually playable (and prevents pad players from having a turning speed advantage in competitive games) but it does allow wheel players to make faster steering corrections. When you get to that level your times will probably improve over your old pad times.

Oh, one more wheel question: I'm not sure if you tried playing any Windows racers with it, but do the Fanatec drivers let you adjust angle limitations? The wheels on Formula 1 cars, for example, have as much of a turning radius as normal cars. My dad's G923 lets you adjust that. It obviously doesn't limit the physical range, but it makes it so that if you turn the wheel, say, 180 degrees, it counts as a full turn.
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vladgd

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Re: Racing Sims
« Reply #19 on: April 13, 2022, 04:38:11 PM »
The only reason I ended up getting my Series X is because they had some program where you could effectively reserve a console if you used a special financing option that covered both the system and two years of GamePass Ultimate. It was slightly more than the combined cost of both (I think it was like $40 more?), but 1) it's still way cheaper than buying it from a scumbag scalper, 2) I would upgraded to GamePass Ultimate anyway (I was already a GamePass PC subscriber), and 3) you can unlock dev mode and install RetroArch, and it's one of the most powerful off-the-shelf emulation boxes money can buy.

Beginning of the month there was actually series x consoles on amazon for like...28 hours. I was tempted to snagging one, but the only exclusives I want to play is...the next elder scrolls game, and that won't be out for a while. Playstation I'll have GT, final fantasy 7 (figured since I now plan on buying a ps5, pointless to spend time on the ps4 version I only spent 2 hours on), more death stranding because I'd totally play it again, and street fighter 6 whenever that hits. Still hard to tell myself no to a new console when I am in the market for one. I did sign up on the playstation website to drop me an email when they feel like selling me a console, so maybe they'll drop me a line in a few...months...

Oh no, you're definitely not alone. There's a pretty big adjustment period with any dedicated controller, but I think steering wheels are probably one of the most extreme cases of that. I think the only thing that's easier with the wheel is shifting with a clutch (Forza lets you do that with a gamepad, but it never felt right to me).

You pretty much have to work up to a point where the wheel becomes second nature, to the point where its primary advantages over the gamepad win out. It's not at all surprising that wheels give you more granular control over the vehicle, but one thing that they don't have is input dampening (except in Horizon, apparently, which is another good reason to avoid that game). Racing games apply a bunch of input filtering on gamepads in order to prevent rapid thumb movements from causing the controls to spaz out. That's good because it makes them actually playable (and prevents pad players from having a turning speed advantage in competitive games) but it does allow wheel players to make faster steering corrections. When you get to that level your times will probably improve over your old pad times.

It's a lot, the more I play the more I think I have to adjust stuff. Now my arms are getting tired from how far the wheel is...but it feels about the same distance as my daily driver. I do typically drive with my right hand on 5 o clock position, resting my arm on the center console thingy. So maybe I just got weak arms, but even then in high traffic or bad weather I am 10 and 2 and I don't notice fatigue driving. There is a huge advantage in steering, but also it's harder because the force feedback does make precise movements a bit more challenging to pull off. As well as big sweeps of the wheel are just more demanding in general. PRACTICE PRACTICE, in the end it'll be faster.

Biggest impediment is the way I am playing GT. I am a power gamer a lot of the time and path of least resistance, get all the things the most efficient way possible...and that is unfortunately the opposite of "getting better at wheel" when I am using pad to gradually cut my times a good 4 minutes faster per run AND making an attempt to learn manual transmission while doing so(no clutch, just paddles or X and Square buttons on pad). After either A I get tired of farming for cash, or B they nerf the method soon I can try and figure out how to learn the game efficiently.

Quote from: gran turismo known issues
- There have been cases where the Performance Points (PP) do not calculate correctly if the maximum output of the engine is adjusted with a Power Restrictor, or if extreme settings or specific operations are performed on a Fully Customisable Transmission.

They didn't patch it in yesterdays update, but it's a known issue...at least it's an issue this time, and not just arbitrarily saying fuck you swipe your credit card this time. The reason I am playing manual in the first place is the gearing to get the car below 600pp basically makes gear 1, 2, and 3 worthless, and on automatic transmission it's really difficult to get to 4th gear if you slow down enough to kick it into third. With manual you can just...yknow, stay in 4th gear.

Oh, one more wheel question: I'm not sure if you tried playing any Windows racers with it, but do the Fanatec drivers let you adjust angle limitations? The wheels on Formula 1 cars, for example, have as much of a turning radius as normal cars. My dad's G923 lets you adjust that. It obviously doesn't limit the physical range, but it makes it so that if you turn the wheel, say, 180 degrees, it counts as a full turn.

VIDEO REPLY BECAUSE yknow showing > telling

*edit*

Trying moving wheel away from my couch changes things. Not better...but I think a lot of my issues were adjusting the settings on the wheel and in game, AND my sitting position. Will have to figure out a better setup in this living room that is also portable enough to put away.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2022, 07:25:33 PM by vladgd »

Spectere

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Re: Racing Sims
« Reply #20 on: April 14, 2022, 02:56:51 AM »
Beginning of the month there was actually series x consoles on amazon for like...28 hours. I was tempted to snagging one, but the only exclusives I want to play is...the next elder scrolls game, and that won't be out for a while. Playstation I'll have GT, final fantasy 7 (figured since I now plan on buying a ps5, pointless to spend time on the ps4 version I only spent 2 hours on), more death stranding because I'd totally play it again, and street fighter 6 whenever that hits. Still hard to tell myself no to a new console when I am in the market for one. I did sign up on the playstation website to drop me an email when they feel like selling me a console, so maybe they'll drop me a line in a few...months...

Well, for what it's worth, you'll be able to play the Series X stuff on PC. It seems like Sony jumped on the timed exclusive train with regards to PC for some games at least, but there's definitely more reason for most people to get a PS5 than a Series console.

I'm honestly surprised that Microsoft hasn't partnered up with Steam to make the Series S/X (and, hell, why not the Xbox One as well?) a Steam Link. It feels like it would be a match made in heaven.

It's a lot, the more I play the more I think I have to adjust stuff. Now my arms are getting tired from how far the wheel is...but it feels about the same distance as my daily driver. I do typically drive with my right hand on 5 o clock position, resting my arm on the center console thingy. So maybe I just got weak arms, but even then in high traffic or bad weather I am 10 and 2 and I don't notice fatigue driving.

I dunno about the Fanatec wheels, but it definitely takes a bit more force to turn the wheel on my dad's G923 than it does on my Civic (in addition to having to fight through the force feedback). I think that's just a side effect of how those wheels are made. It definitely gives you a workout.

Biggest impediment is the way I am playing GT. I am a power gamer a lot of the time and path of least resistance, get all the things the most efficient way possible...and that is unfortunately the opposite of "getting better at wheel" when I am using pad to gradually cut my times a good 4 minutes faster per run AND making an attempt to learn manual transmission while doing so(no clutch, just paddles or X and Square buttons on pad). After either A I get tired of farming for cash, or B they nerf the method soon I can try and figure out how to learn the game efficiently.

Ah yeah, I know that feeling. It's hard to commit to a different control style when you're at a certain level of mastery with a different one, especially when you're in a situation where there's an easy, and undoubtedly temporary, method for farming.

VIDEO REPLY BECAUSE yknow showing > telling

Yooo, thanks! The one I was looking for was the "maximum steering angle." Gotta say, their config tool looks a lot more pleasant to use than the Logitech one.

Meh, I'll probably just save up for one of the Fanatec wheels. I've always loved me some racers, and it seems like every time I stop by my parents' place I wind up spending at least an hour placing racing sims on my dad's rig.

Trying moving wheel away from my couch changes things. Not better...but I think a lot of my issues were adjusting the settings on the wheel and in game, AND my sitting position. Will have to figure out a better setup in this living room that is also portable enough to put away.

That's the nice part about having a full on sim rig. Much easier to find a comfortable position, and much harder to stow the damn thing.
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